[Discussion] US and UK spy agencies defeat privacy and security on the internet

Robin Paulson robin at bumblepuppy.org
Mon Sep 9 17:05:07 NZST 2013

On 2013-09-09 06:56, Jaco van der Merwe - Workshop Enterprises Ltd. 
> Another rather good post by Schneier, with some basic remedies -
> http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/05/nsa-how-to-remain-secure-surveillance

he has written a few good things in the wake of this, i'm impressed the 
guardian has taken him on.

> We - aka "the rest of the world" - have been treated like this for a
> very long time now, and being surprised that now the same tools have
> been turned on those citizenry seems to me to be incredibly naive 
> (again
> referring to mass-media here).

maybe it is naive, but saying that to someone who didn't previously know 
sounds like nothing more than a put down. some people have been 
educated, have learned something; that is a bonus, not an opportunity to 
belittle them. let's build on that and encourage them to do something, 
rather than attempt to censor what they say, discourage them and say 
"this is normal, nothing to see here, move along".

> Privacy & InfoSec community have been warning *for ages* that exactly
> this sort of thing could/would happen, so nothing has really actually
> changed IMHO. I'm just really surprised it took a Snowden to bring this

yes something has happened, more ordinary people are aware of what is 
happening. perception is important.

>>   That is what people are pissed off about.
> Making a lot of noise, yes, but are people *really* ticked off? I'm not
> so sure.
> Names have been named & some specifics have been exposed, but nothing
> has really happened to change behaviour.

i have started encrypting and signing emails when receivers will accept 
them, and am not using google at all. i talk to other people, alert them 
to the problems and encourage them to do similar. others are doing the 
same. every one person who stops using google/yahoo/microsoft/facebook 
as a result of this is a gain. no, there hasn't been a mass uprising, 
but there doesn't have to be for change to happen

the discussions show some people are concerned and are doing something, 
it boggles the mind to think you've jumped into a discussion about 
privacy, to say no-one cares about it!

> Just look at the various companies' share-prices over the periods of
> revelation.

well, yes, but share markets don't reflect what ordinary people think, 
they reflect the actions of rich, greedy, selfish people. by definition 
they are disconnected, in a world of their own, and not much of a 
measure of commoners.

there's a certain disdain for the common man and woman which has been 
brewing for the last 30+ years in the west. we have seen violent 
explosions against it in the last few years in france (2005), england 
(2011), sweden (2013) amongst other places, and a continued indifference 
to those kind of problems usually doesn't bode well. this is yet another 
example of that disdain.


What the world needs now, is love sweet love

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